What Do You Think Of The Hunter vs Farmer Theory

[Nicki]

I just started one of Thom Hartmann's book about ADHD really being a survival trait from long ago, when people with certain "hunter" characteristics could survive in the woods better than those with "farmer" characteristics.
I am not sure how I eel about this theory so far. I feel like Harmann portrays people who are slowed down by their ADHD problems to be a bunch of whiners. He complains that some people "insist" on thinking of themselves as victims of a disease, even though he says others with ADHD who use the hunter vs. farmer theories are not slowed down by their ADHD at all. He seems to think that we could all cure ADHD just by thinking differently about ourselves.
In part of this book, he talks about success stories, and how some people "overcame" ADHD by making changes in their lives. One person began shutting the door to his office while he worked. Another began turning off the TV when he had conversations.
Those are good strategies, I guess, but with my ADHD, I don't think shutting my door while I worked would suddenly solve all my problems!
I wondered if others of you have read this book or heard of this theory, and what you think about it!

[Miss K]

I haven't read the book and based on what you're saying I'm not sure that I would want to :)

I'm just going to briefly comment on what you've said about it though...

Obviously, there are new habits that we can all learn to help us feel more at peace in our environments, and maybe even be more productive. But this guy sounds like a total jacka--. I spent several years trying to systematically "fix" the chaos in my life, in a very thoughtful and logical way before I finally was willing to explore the possibility that something outside of logic or will-power was at play in my brain and my life. I addressed my hypoglycemia, I started making different relationship choices, examined my family history, looked hard at my life choices, thought about different kinds of employment that might be better for me, went to therapy, and found new strategies for dealing with my education that made getting through the process more productive and achievable for me.

Still, I found myself, anxious, compelled, fidgety, reactive and with a mind that, while sometimes creative and fantastic, was always WAY too busy, driving me further into overcommitment and further from living life in the depth that I wanted to...and I'm a very high functioning person. Attitudes like this guy's really cheese me off, not only for myself, but when I think about how many others with ADHD may have had a more difficult journey than mine, and this guy is going to try to tell them they should just "get over it"...sheesh. If I could have "gotten over it" on my own, I certainly did everything a reasonable person could do on their own.

I've been working with overhead lights off in my office and the door closed for years, and while it makes it easier for me to work, it sure didn't fix my brain or my life!

I also have read that theory elsewhere about hunters vs. farmers and I think it's a bunch of poo.

I agree that all people, regardless of their circumstances should strive to be the best they can be, and try to be proactive...but if you are translating his attitude accurately, to me, he sounds like an ignorant boob.

[Bryan Hutchinson]

Hrmmm... this is kind of harsh and not completely an accurate description of Tom Hartmann's complete idea concerning those of us with ADHD - he also has ADHD. Actually, part of what he means is that before our civilized culture ADHD was not an issue. It wasn’t either; one of the very first writings about ADHD was only about 150 years ago. Think about it a bit further, schools the way they are now, with being overcrowded and the standards kids must meet are completely different. He is basically saying that the skills we needed to survive back 200 years ago and further (caveman days) are not the skills we now need in todays world and we have evolved so fast technically and mechanically that our evolvement as humans has not caught up – that’s why the ‘farmers’ do better in a structured society whereas the hunters would not, which is true… now are hunters the people with ADHD? That’s open to debate, but it is a logical assumption. A good book by Hartmann is The Edison Gene and also Healing ADD, both are very good books and not simply a breakdown of hunter/farmer.

I personally wouldn't be so harsh on someone who has written several books on ADHD, with several different theories and solutions. I also don't think when he writes about shuting a door that that is intended to be a complete solution or that it will work for everyone, for every situation. Did he actually write 'just get over it?' Certainly doesn't sound like what he would write.

[DANA]

Nicki, I attempted to read the same book and in all honesty, I grew bored with it. I understood the authors main idea's, but I found the book to be too lengthy and too detailed to grasp my full attention. However, I am an avid reader when it comes to books that do interest me.

As far as the theory of "hunters" and "farmers", it is a creative idea, but I personally am the type of individual who firmly believes that ADHD is much more than that. One more thought is that NOT all individuals have the same type of ADD/ADHD. One individual may be shy, a day dreamer, passive and be diagnosed with inattentive ADD, while another individual may be a hyperactive, talkative individual who is not able to keep still and diagnosed with ADHD. So does this make them BOTH the Hunter or the Farmer? How could they be the same when it is so apparent that these two individuals are so very different from one another?

[Bryan Hutchinson]

btw... what's the title of the book? He has quite a few - I may not have read this one you are talking about...

[Nicki]

The book I'm reading is ADD Success Stories. I don't know why it irritates me so much... It just seemed like he kept bringing up how people with ADHD want to think of themselves as victims, and there's a chapter called "Professional Victims" or something like that, and saying that there's no excuse for people with ADHD to not succeed when others with ADHD are very successful. I mean I know its supposed to be encouraging, but to me it was sort of DIScouraging, like he was calling me a lazy complaining victm!

[Bryan Hutchinson]

I haven't read that book and, I must admit that sounds a lot like tough love. I would have to read it to really get a perspective as to what he is referring too. If what your saying is accurate that does indeed sound a bit insensitive and from the other books of his that I have read, well, that just doesn't seem to sound like him. Maybe it is from the perspective of those specific success stories of people who 'cowboy'd up'? That would not work for me. However, there are those with ADHD who have become successful and do sincerely believe that ADDer's just need to get their groove on or flip a switch and, well, if that worked then we wouldn't have ADHD in the first place... As you know, I am all for the power of positive thinking, but, it is a process, it is not like switching a light switch... again, though, I will have to read it before I comment directly about the book... thx!

[ReneeA68]

Hi Nicki,
I am currently re-reading The Edison Gene by Thom Hartmann and I've always found it fascinating. While there are aspects that may at this point be a tad dated, overall his text pointed to each individual reaching an acceptance and perhaps appreciation of the gifts that come with the setbacks. To fully appreciate, we must understand the nature of them. The traits he describes as Hunter were more useful as survival mechanism, but gradually receded without the need for having the constantly roving mind and being on guard for change.

With the advent of this highly competitive modern age of stress in schools & the workplace, it is rather akin to the old days of survival -inducing the fight or flight mechanism. Often those that can pay attention to a million things at once (none too deeply unless you are in the zone) or think outside the box on a regular basis do well. "Hunting" for new technology & solutions in the urban jungle, as it were, are suddenly in vogue again.

He explains the biologic ability our genes have to flip on or off as needed - A built-in automation which aids in survival, and keeps us on "power saver mode" if something isn't needed. Of course this works over time, and in those individuals that harbor this particular DNA strand which may or may nor be active, life events can trigger these to once again ignite the pilot light.

Each of us individually has to experiment and *fail* in order to find the right combination of things that allows us to shut out the extraneous, and focus on a given task. This is harder for us ADDers when it is not something of interest.

Thanks for the interesting question, and best of luck to you :)

[C.J. MacKechnie]

I have not read the book. But, Have thought about the premise.
The farmer will spend his life thinking about what he must do in an organized step by step approach. Which he may organize in a specific order of importance. The farmers attention and focus will not exceed his farm.
The hunter. On the other hand must look out as far as he can in his surrounding area and always be vigilant of where the danger may be or where the danger may come from. The hunter cannot focus on in one thing or he may end up the hunted. The hunter must pay attention to everything everywhere all at once. I guess the hunter of old would be the soldier/warrior of today. Because if one pays to much attention to any one thing then you end up dead or a product of a power pole.

[blah]

I did not read the book, but I did some reading online about the hunter vs. farmer theory. I guess it's just a way of looking at ADD, and perhaps the theory in itself could be a coping mechanism. As far as I can tell right now I think it's good to put emphasis on the positive side of ADD, using this theory.

Seeing ADDers as hunters, seeing yourself as a hunter, does explain a lot of things we have trouble doing, or are good at. If you know which things these are you can make use of it. Also it could explain your weaknesses, and if you know which ones those are you can find ways to cope with those. It would make no sense for a hunter to farm or for a farmer to hunt, unless in an exceptional situation.

Perhaps you could say I have always felt like a hunter in a farmers civilization. I sort of adapted, but it never felt right. It made me very proud when I was able to grow nice crops, but that one time I had to shoot the bunnies that ate my crops felt so much better. When I did shoot the bunnies it made my fellow farmers proud of me, yet they were glad they could continue growing crops right after that, while I on the other hand, got bored with the crops and kept looking for bunnies, or even bears maybe.

As there are no bunnies or bears to shoot where I live, I am still not sure on how exactly I can accomplish feeling like I shot bunnies or bears. Knowing the issue makes things easier instantly though. But then again, I only know I have ADD for half a year now, and I am not even diagnosed yet.

I think it's important to me though to keep remembering I am a hunter, and I have to try not to try and blend in with the farmers.

Luckily some people understand, like Potential New Lover, who was very impressed I was able to spot his train on the timetable (while intoxicated), before he could even blink. The second time we needed to spot a departure time he didn't even try and asked me to look for the train (which of course I had spotted before he could finish his question).

Maybe there is some genetic truth in the theory (personally I don't think so), but I think it's best to see it as a metaphor, one you could even use to explain ADD to others.

[Michelle MacGregor]

I think that nothing persists in nature unless it has some use. Some things might become unecessary, while others become more necessary and become selected out over time.

It is useful to think of ADD/ADHD in this way for me because it takes the condition out of the realm of disorder and puts it in the realm adaptation, just one that happens to be troublesome in some areas. I bet it is not troublesome in places in Africa, China or Indonesia where people are still living in a much more agrarian society!

The thing is that for me understanding that this is simply an adaptation that is not necessarily useful in all settings then I do not feel "disordered."

Also, because I was only recently diagnosed and am almost 40, I have come to accept who I am and how I do things. Because I am bright, like most ADD/ADHDers are, I have over my lifetime put into place many adaptive behaviors that structure my time and household in a way that is useful to me. I previously worked in a profession riddled with pressure and deadlines (which for me is the impetus for being able to work - I cannot work without pressure). I always overschedule and have a project going that I may or may not finish, but I never require myself to finish. I knit for fun and sometimes give them away as gifts if I make the deadline - if not, I keep working on them and find another way to use the project. I take photographs, but never really on a deadline or for money for the most part because the pressure to put my art out there for judgment makes me collapse, but will sell it at a later date if someone wants to buy it.

I enjoy my personality - I enjoy how much I love smells and the fact that the smell of lilacs in the springtime can send me almost into ecstasy - no one else gets that! I also enjoy that a great cup of coffee or a song makes me almost want to cry with joy.

The downside to feeling so deeply is that I feel sad things just as deeply and in a perverse way enjoy the pain almost as much as I enjoy the joy. I have learned to manage this by indulging in sad movies and books - or sad songs - and enjoying it.

I have come to all of these things because I had no idea that I had ADD until just recently, so to not see this as a disorder, but as nature's way of rewarding a certain type of behavior that was evolutionarily advantageous is a fantastic explanation to me!

I have to say though also that I have not read the book so I do not know if it is dismissive in nature or not.

[Scott]

I think it is true, and I am an example of it. I think most of us are. We have too much 'at once' processing ability in our brains. We don't like it when things are too slow and predictable. We have split-second 'moments of clarity'. We thrive on overcoming a genuine, defined obstacle.

We are the apparatus of much of recorded human progress, frankly.

It sounds hyperbolic- but I honestly (and not without either long-thought nor gravitas) think ADHD (the naturally-selected adaptation, gene-wise) is what made the industrial age and modern era.

It is a disadvantage to be fast-thinking, creative and adaptable in a timecard punching, factory worker society. How could it NOT be?

How the hell did my formal education end 3 months into the 8th grade and everyone thinks I am some kind of freaking PHD? People just think I'm messing with them when I say I just learned all my shit on my own without actually 'trying'. Too much of everything is what it feels like.

Too much quick attention, peripheral awareness, intellectual playfulness, poetics, feeling, boredom.

I can feel some of the truth of Hartmann's book in my blood, playfully taunting the modern life I live.

The real problem is: so what?

[Mags Smith]

I agree about ADDers being hunters, not farmers.

But we still need the hunters!!

There would be no innovation without ADD traits in my view.

All progress and creativity involves risk and free thinking - which ADDers have in spades.

He is talking b*llocks X10000

I doubt he knows much at all about life with ADHD - the good stuff or the challenges.